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Let's make a map! (Forum Game idea)

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To all editors, old and new, here is a State of the Map update (and I may do one of these each week to summarize progress and announce current direction):

Currently, we are at a crossroads. We have JUST reached a point in this map where our protagonist undergoes a class change, becoming any one of a number (currently that number is 2) of legitimate heroes instead of the peasant he was before.

Currently, the farthest the map reaches is the scenarios which introduce the player to the new classes.

So maybe you've glanced at this thread from time to time and thought "Well how can I help? I don't have a lot of time/experience/interest/fingers/etc."

Here is how you can help, how anybody can help!


1. By designing a new class for our hero to become. The process to integrate a new class into the map is very clearly described in trigger comments, so you won't have to go digging to figure out how to add your thing without breaking something else. For any hero you create, you should also create a short area that introduces that hero to the player, and familiarizes them with the hero's new abilities.

2. By building new areas for people to explore AFTER the class change. Currently, nothing follows the class change intros, and it would be great to have more to do with our freshly upgraded guy! The map has recently had its size increased, so you really don't have to worry about space for the time being!

3. Testing the map and either reporting or fixing bugs you come across. Or just providing general feedback! We want this map to be fun for anybody to play. But to do that, we need to know what people do find fun, so more of it can be made.


If you want to join us on this noble quest of collaborative map work, please do! Just make sure you leave a notice here on the thread if you are doing map work so nobody else takes it and starts fiddling until you are done!
 
I'd make it happen, but I'm kinda running dry on ideas atm. The only thing I can think of is some sort of regeneration-based warrior that spends health to execute abilities and become stronger the more damaged he is. Dunno, could be some sort of high risk/reward class? The problem I have with this class is that is doesn't sound terribly interesting to play as.
 
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I think we should have sub-classes.
Also is anyone up to voice acting or knows how to add voices. The cutscenes are long and boring to read. Maybe add music and possibly some more humour.
Serious story =/= no humour
I'm gonna do some very minor edits to the map

Done, didn't add much. did some terrain doodads, might look ugly or not fit if you deem it so.
I added a spiders nest to the starting area.
And edited some dialogue. Might have done some other stuff too.
 

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Every detail-focused edit is as valuable as sweeping dungeon design. Your efforts are greatly appreciated, Age.

Can you explain your sub-classes idea more thoroughly? It's still early enough in the class-change process that a substantial change could be easily instituted, but that time will end if we get a few more classes under our belt.

As for voice work... I guess it could be done. It would be a very serious effort, though. Maybe there are some resources out there... like systems that would just synthesize different voices... if such a thing could be found, a single person could just go through the triggers and do voice for all dialogue... but that would be a massive effort, and all the scenes would have to be retimed.

I'm not against it, just being realistic about the effort involved.
 
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Every detail-focused edit is as valuable as sweeping dungeon design. Your efforts are greatly appreciated, Age.

Can you explain your sub-classes idea more thoroughly? It's still early enough in the class-change process that a substantial change could be easily instituted, but that time will end if we get a few more classes under our belt.

As for voice work... I guess it could be done. It would be a very serious effort, though. Maybe there are some resources out there... like systems that would just synthesize different voices... if such a thing could be found, a single person could just go through the triggers and do voice for all dialogue... but that would be a massive effort, and all the scenes would have to be retimed.

I'm not against it, just being realistic about the effort involved.

Yes, I do think that voice work would be very hard.
As for sub classes I mean like for example:

Let's say there is a hunter class. That hunter class would become either a ranger, or a beastmaster.

For an in game example the necromancer might become a Lich which focuses on damaging spells or a Necrozard (??? Something cool sounding) Which focuses on summoning skeletons and spells based on the skeletons.
 
Yes, I do think that voice work would be very hard.
As for sub classes I mean like for example:

Let's say there is a hunter class. That hunter class would become either a ranger, or a beastmaster.

For an in game example the necromancer might become a Lich which focuses on damaging spells or a Necrozard (??? Something cool sounding) Which focuses on summoning skeletons and spells based on the skeletons.

Oh, you mean specialisations? Yeah, definitely something I think would make the gameplay richer. Need at least one more class though :p
 
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Let me throw this idea out there.

Doing specialization is possible, but I think it should come later on. Like trigger it so when a character hits level 6, they get the option.

And I just feel like the best way to integrate specialization into a project already this big would be to just unlearn certain skills and replace them with upgraded versions or just a different one altogether.

What do you guys think about that?
 
Specialisations could also be a choice between several ultimates + a new skill. Like in Heroes of the Storm, upon reaching level 10, you get to pick between two ults. The same can be done when Jack hits level 6, and when he learns his ultimate, he is given the choice between 2 or more ults. Using Spellbook might be a way of doing this - you learn the Spellbook ult, and within in contains the actual choices.

It doesn't have to be a completely new class.
 
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!!!EDITING DONE!!!
!!!NEW UPDATE!!!
Tornado buff no longer appears on units with the Hero Glow ability.


Change Log:

Fixed a couple dialogue issues with Ravager.

Expanded Class Change room to better suit purposes of adding future classes.

Decorated Class Change room.

Added a Boss Fight following the class introduction scenarios. I think this is one of my best creations ever, so please let me know what you think!




Something I haven't been able to fix:

The Necromancer's summons tend to summon the wrong thing. Like you'll click on warriors but end up with archers. I'm not sure where exactly the issue is in this, or how to fix it.


I have also attached an updated scenario map.
 

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Anyone in for a subclass? Heres what i think could be..

Necromancer -can become ArchNecromancer(More skeles) or Minor Lich(more dmg spells)

Shadowstalker could become- Darkstalker(More stealth spells) or Shadowagent(more dm spells)

Ravager could become Eradicator(more area dmgs) or Punisher[Um....](Single spells more powerful)
 
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Anyone in for a subclass? Heres what i think could be..

Necromancer -can become ArchNecromancer(More skeles) or Minor Lich(more dmg spells)

Shadowstalker could become- Darkstalker(More stealth spells) or Shadowagent(more dm spells)

Ravager could become Eradicator(more area dmgs) or Punisher[Um....](Single spells more powerful)

I think Shadowstalker could become Darkstalker or Swiftblade (Speed focused hero.)
Ravager could become Eradicator or Crusader (Which focuses on health and armor)
 
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I fall more in line with the suggestions of Spellbound where we just have a choice in ultimate for each class.

I've already considered that for the shadowstalker I can have the Smoke Bomb, and add the option of a passive ability based on bash that gives a chance to stun.

And for another class I'm working on, it's ultimate would be a choice between bladestorm and a modified stampede.

And heck, we can just trigger the choice to add a few points to whichever stats we want a few more points in.
 
Editing will take a little while. Edit if you wish, I'll just import the changes later if a new version is out by then.

Okay, I'll have a go at it. I will be changing a few skills for the ravager if y'all don't mind, and possibly do the two ultimates as an example of what I mean by specialisations.

EDIT: I'm making a Necro v2. Won't replace current Necro.
 
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Since spellbound edits can be imported. I'll be editing the map :)

EDIT : Almost done with the terrain, gonna upload the new version later today. :)

EDIT 2 : Almost done with the scenario, adding final touches!
 
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He never realized Holy Light could hurt the undead. He never used Muradin or Arthas's ultimates, or divine shield. He saved the dwarf base in northrend but never bothered to enter the base and take control of it. He attacked the bases in defense missions. He destroyed his own arcane sanctum during an attack.

It just... it amazes me that WCIII can be beaten with that much... overlooked. It actually makes me feel REALLY BAD that sometimes even to this day certain missions can be challenging for me. Maybe I just seriously overestimated my own skills.

...huh...
I'll be instituting a new class in my next update: a wardancer or battle jester or whatever I end up calling it.
It will have acid bomb (as normal)
It will have a modified mirror image that summons a single clone that deals 30/40/50% normal damage, takes 5x/4x/3x normal damage, and lasts for up to 15/30/45 seconds. I call it Shadow Servant.
It will have evasion.
Its ultimates will be Bladestorm, or a modified Stampede that summons a massive rain of individually weak knives to fly across the screen. Knifestorm.
 
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Here it is! :) sorry for the long wait

Change Log :
-Scenario 13 added
-Changed last boss's owner to teal (player 3) if that's okay, it interrupts the 13th scenario for some reason
-Changed Jacks move speed from 150 to 225


I think that the boss room's scenario is too long, I literally leave the game and do other stuff while I wait for it to let me fight the guy.
Maybe reduce the texts ? or make an option to skip the cinematic ?

And the (haunted library + class change intro) scenarios are linked, which is a long wait too.

Ps : I forgot to change camera boundary from last seen. :3
 

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Level 6
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I know how to easily make the dialogue skippable.

My plan is to put a conditional branch at the start of every major dialogue scene. An if/then/else.

It will go like this:
If
(CinemaOn = True)
Then
(scene plays as normal)
Else
(it skips all dialogue and only performs essential functions)


Then, I can add a ultility trigger so people can type -cinemaon and -cinemaoff to toggle the CinemaOn variable.


This way, for all us editors, we can skip all that and just edit without the waits. And when the map is done and ready for posting, we can just have map initialization toggle that variable on.


What do you guys think? I just want to hear a couple confirmations of the idea before I institute.
 
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Ima check out and please someone add a function to skip cinematics to help the poor next generations

I may add a "skip cinematic" function too all long cinematic scenes if no one beats me to it.

@Quill
That sounds good! and you should make a game text show this info as a tip for players too.
 
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Good news spellbound!!! My work is done!!!! And only 10 minutes past my predicted 1 hour window.

Change Log:

Substantially weakened the spiders in the shipwreck area. Now poor Jack won't get destroyed before his quest begins.

Changed the way a few visibility modifier regions worked so the regions would be correctly disabled after the scenarios.

Fixed it so that items Jack carried pre-class change now drop in the intro area of the appropriate class, ensuring that those items get to be carried onward. (on second thought I didn't actually test this... somebody else may want to make sure it works)

Modified the non-warping utility triggers to give a notice that they have been used. (So now typing -fullheal will give a notice saying Jack has been healed).

Corrected the end of the boss fight to change the camera bounds.

At 5 seconds in game, a message pops up informing the player that there is a list of utility cheats in the quest menu. The quest menu now contains an optional quest listing them. This material is intended to be removed before the final map is published.

The following dialogue events are now skippable with the -cinemaoff cheat:
Entering the Fighter/Riddler area
The Fighter/Riddler scene
The Jack/Rose dialogue when entering the torture room
The signpost scene in the Spike Maze room
The event at the end of the Force Labyrinth
The Library event
The class change room dialogue event
Shadowstalker change dialogue event
Necromancer change dialogue event
Ravagar change dialogue event
The boss room dialogue event
The Snowy Mountain Troll/Tuskarr choice event dialogue


Please note that these skips were designed quickly. It is EXTREMELY POSSIBLE that I missed something in the course of the design. If a scenario is not functioning properly that was previously fine, PLEASE REPORT IT IMMEDIATELY! Either I or another editor will look into it as quickly as possible and get it corrected.
 

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Alright, EDITING IN PROGRESS. Fair warning, I imported a bunch of systems into the map, namely a Unit Indexer, a DDS and an Unit Event system, all by Bribe. The DDS has a slight learning curve so of any of you have any questions concerning it, ask and I'll help. Additionally, if you use Mana Shield, Anti-Magic Shell, Locust Swarm or Life Drain, the spells need to be triggered so let me know and I'll handle those.

EDITING DONE

- I have added a second version of the Necromancer which has 3 basic skills and 2 ultimates that each unlock 2 skills. That's my take on Specialisations.
- it's 0220 am right now and I'm too damn tired to do any polishing, so I've simply tacked on the Necro v2 selection onto the existsing Necro. Simply type Necromancer v2 to pick.
- The Sanguis Pyxis spell must be manually learned to work, so that's why the Necro v2 was not preplaced. Honestly I have no idea why preplacing the heroes are required.
- I forgot to give the hero and Orb of Respite so you could prolly do that.
- Necro v2 does not have a specific arena. I don't think he needs one.

IMPORTANT:
I have added Unit Indexer, Damage Engine and Unit Events to the map. I recommend using them as they can make your life a lot easier. They certainly made all those custom spells possible.

I do hope you guys enjoy the Necro v2.
Cheers!
 

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Oh boy.

Ok. Um. Spellbound, this class is totally awesome.

I don't want you to lose sight of that for a second.

But it is going to take some serious work to get it integrated into the map.

First of all, one of our necromancers should be renamed and have its model changed.

Secondly, the zombie minions don't teleport to new scenarios with the necromancer v2. This means that they get stuck somewhere, and he can't make any more.
I've thought about this, and I think the simplest way to handle this is to have a trigger add [last created unit] to a unit group variable every time the minion power is used, then give the v2 a power that lets him instantly call and minions from that group to his side.
That way, no other preexisting triggers have to be modified.
I think. I'm going to have to dig through triggers and make sure about this.

The necromancer v2 needs his own intro area, especially given that his complexity level is far beyond that of the other existing options. He should also have his own triggering place in the Lich's Chapel.

Basically, I'm just going to need some time to figure out how some of this stuff actually works before I know where to make fixes and what can be adapted.


Editing done.

Change Log:

Decorated the Shadowstalker Intro area.

Decorated the boss room

Created the Grim Jester class and added it to the Lich's Chapel. The Grim Jester is an agility hero with the following abilities:
Acid Bomb (as the base power)
Shadow Servant (mirror image, but creates a single copy that deals 30/45/60% damage, keeps the Evasion power of the Grim Jester, and takes 5/4/3 times normal damage and lasts up to 20/30/40 seconds.
Evasion (as the base power)
Rain of Blades (stampede, but summons way more projectiles, the projectiles are blades, each dealing 15 damage with no splash, also hits air units)

Created the intro area for the Grim Jester class- a shimmering forest area that hopefully doesn't look terrible. Terraining is not my strong suit... as everything I've ever added to this map demonstrates.

Modified it so that starting the class change scenarios properly destroy the visual modifier over the lich's chapel.

Decorated the snowy mountain area.

When I tried to save the map, it alerted me to errors in the scripts. It's just on one of the Sanguis Pyxis triggers. I may have accidentally hit delete on something, IDK. But that's a fairly small script, so I hope somebody can spot the problem easily.


I'm also having an error.
If the Grim Jester has a de/buff on him and then uses Shadow Servant, the de/buff icon remains and reads "Tool Tip Missing."
This is HOW my error is being caused, but I don't know how this can be corrected.
 

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Ok I'll take a look, and make the Dancing Cadavers port to the Necro v2's side whenever there's an area change.

I'll just add two variables per area transition to create an event that handles porting. This way, you don't have to check whether Jack's entered this or that region and you can just refer to Jack's new location.

I'll also look into the Sanguis Pyxis errors.

EDITING DONE

I've added the following:
  • Set AreaChangeEvent = 1.00
  • Set AreaChangeEvent = 0.00
every time after Jack is moved. This tells the game that he has changed location, which tell a new trigger I made to move the Dancing Cadavers to his location. This is made possible by adding all summoned unit to a unit group called Jack_Minions, so if you want to make summoning units an ability Jack has, just add them to that unit group and they should move along with him.

NB: Dancing Cadavers belonging to player 1 will always be added to Jack_Minions, so avoid using them anywhere else. Or you can just remove specific ones from the unit group if you want to.

Also fixed the problem with the Sanguis Pyxis - I used vJASS comment code /* */ to enable code continuity in a line break, but you need JNGP for that to work, so I removed it.

I've not added a new area yet. Maybe later.
 

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Wait Spellbound! I found a generic fix that will work for ALL classes that summon!

You just need two triggers. The first one goes as follows
Event
A unit [spawns a summoned unit]
Condition
Unit [summoning unit] is equal to [Jack]
Action
Add [summoned unit] to [unit group variable]



Then you just need a trigger that calls [unit group variable] to [Jack].
This fix is simple, and it will cover ALL summons for ALL classes, current and future!!!

This way, a SINGLE action pasted in each area transition trigger will be sufficient to ensure that all minons follow Jack!!!
 
Wait Spellbound! I found a generic fix that will work for ALL classes that summon!

You just need two triggers. The first one goes as follows
Event
A unit [spawns a summoned unit]
Condition
Unit [summoning unit] is equal to [Jack]
Action
Add [summoned unit] to [unit group variable]



Then you just need a trigger that calls [unit group variable] to [Jack].
This fix is simple, and it will cover ALL summons for ALL classes, current and future!!!

This way, a SINGLE action pasted in each area transition trigger will be sufficient to ensure that all minons follow Jack!!!

That's pretty much what I did, but that doesn't work for Dancing Cadavers since it's based off Carrion Bettles. Those don't trigger the summoned unit event, so I had to just add stuff to the unit group whenever the zombies were indexed.
 
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