Do you like the new site changes?

I don't think TDB should have been banned at all. A stern note and a couple of infraction points would have been enough IMHO.

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I like the forum changes, but they don't really have that much effect.
I have no opinion on the staff changes. Those are a matter for the existing staff to work out, I have confidence in Hive to pull through this transition. I won't comment more on that.
I dislike the loss of coloured names and the images, not for any particular reason except that they looked good. The images looked professional and fitted with the theme of the site.

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The most important change here is obviously in the staff. I seriously think that the banning of TDB should be reviewed. However, as I said, I have confidence in the staff that they will ensure that the new mods are trained correctly.

Originally Posted by Hakeem

You are wrong. The results show that many regular users voted to have the colors back. Colors is, at press time, simultaneously, the least liked, and most disliked, change.

Just like how eye candy wins the show in 99% of spell contests, pretty colors win the show with the vast majority of users. I don't think most users even recognize the benefits of the colors, they just think they look pretty and will follow whatever the person before them used as the logic. Regardless of that, though, Ralle did the colors, so I don't know why I'm stuck defending his decision, but let's roll with it since that seems to be what I'm here for.

I mentioned earlier somewhere that they were good on the main page because it helped you pick people apart, but that's about the only real benefit I see. I think it's a little naive to claim that you wouldn't be here today if the admins weren't gray or the global mods weren't blue, but who am I to say -- I know no better than you the machinations of fate.

Currently, my only real concern is the lack of ability to tell admins apart from moderators. I agree that something should be done there, and if you want it to be colors than more power to you (Though for me they were an eyesore). I can't actually think of any legitimate reason why colors shouldn't exist, but then again I can't really think of any reason why text effects don't work either. So long as you can tell admins from mods, it really doesn't matter. Unfortunately, a lot of users are way too unused to change and are now flipping out about it. In the end, though, it's really up to Ralle and the admins with how they want to distinguish mods from admins. I definitely don't think being extremist is logical, though, so your point about the black and white was rather moot.

Originally Posted by Hakeem

Moderators should not have access to IP addresses, or the ability to give infractions, and ban a user, this is what admins are trusted to do.

Recently there was a user banned by a mod at the "request" of a user. I do not see that the moderator should be demoted, but that the ability to ban should be revoked from all forum moderators. Banning is something to be trusted to an admin.

If I am to understand the infraction system, moderators can give infractions, of any point value, at any time, and 10 infraction points results in a ban. This gives moderators the ability to ban. Sure it was TheDivineBoss, but that was just today. Who will it be tomorrow? In my opinion, if you want a user banned and the current admins are not fulfilling their duties adequately, then you need to find someone who can be trusted to be an admin.

Okay, yeah, alright? Was that directed at me or just a general comment on the powers available to mods? I agree that admins should be the only ones to ban and that infraction is a pretty stupid idea. I mean really, people dish out 9 things of refraction to users for stupid reasons; ask HT, he knows. What you need are admins that do things with the public and interact with the public frequently; I have no idea who that would include, but that sounds like something that certain members of the current staff need to work out. I think everyone so far has agreed on a staff revamp; that is inevitable, I would imagine.

Shit I'm tired, I hope that post makes as much sense to you in reading it as it did the moment I typed it.

Originally Posted by Rising_Dusk

I think it's a little naive to claim that you wouldn't be here today if the admins weren't gray or the global mods weren't blue, but who am I to say -- I know no better than you the machinations of fate.

No, but I might not be here if not for how awesome the site looks.

Originally Posted by Rising_Dusk

Currently, my only real concern is the lack of ability to tell admins apart from moderators.

Hmm. I didn't notice that. If someone is promoted or demoted in the current system, it's hard, if not impossible, to tell.

Originally Posted by Rising_Dusk

I definitely don't think being extremist is logical, though, so your point about the black and white was rather moot.

Subtle logical fallacies can be magnified by use of an extreme example. Why bother even bolding a staff members name if they have the extra user title? (Actually, that's not a half bad idea, but I still liked the colors as they helped me see who has what powers very quickly.)

Originally Posted by Rising_Dusk

Okay, yeah, alright? Was that directed at me or just a general comment on the powers available to mods?

Originally Posted by Rising_Dusk

I'm tired

You must be. :p
I put a spacing bar of width 256 between my response to your post and my general comments.

For the color thingie - it's all about eye candy, right.
In most forums, colors are described supposed to make clear that certain users belong to a group, like moderators are e.g. orange, globals lime-green and so on.
That really helps discovering out what group the single user belong to..

Remaking the staff brings up heavy problems sometimes:
Competent staffmembers could leave, incompetent could be approved working as staff. The only thing i'd do if i was admin, would be to give something like an ultimatum to every single inactive moderator, global, ect..
And if they don't fulfill it (get back to activity) they will be down graded but with a special remark that if they apply in future they have better chances to get re-upgraded.. if you know what i mean :D

Originally Posted by DrazharLn

I don't think TDB should have been banned at all. A stern note and a couple of infraction points would have been enough IMHO.

Not to sound rude or anything, but you're really not in a position to say. TDB has been a repeat offender, he's been getting infractions since several weeks after he joined. He's already been banned at least once to my knowledge, and there comes a point where enough is enough. He KNEW he was crossing the line when he did what he did, but for some damned reason that I can't understand he must have talked himself into thinking that we would oblige under his half-assed warping of the rules. Not a chance. He's out, and it's for 2 weeks. Next time it'll be permanent.

Originally Posted by Hakeem

No, but I might not be here if not for how awesome the site looks.

Well, I know that aesthetics matter the least when deciding if I want to stay at a site or not. It's like only playing a game for its eye candy and valuing said looks more than actual game play or something. Matter of opinion, of course, but I think you will agree that you're here for either the community or content rather than just how pretty it looks.

Originally Posted by Hakeem

Why bother even bolding a staff members name if they have the extra user title? (Actually, that's not a half bad idea, but I still liked the colors as they helped me see who has what powers very quickly.)

Maybe the colored names works for the hive because there's only one theme and not twelve, since that's what I'm used to. Bolding is just to differentiate between mods and admins, really. I think colors were good when you had 6 different ranks in the staff (Owner should be included in an admin slot, they shouldn't be dissociate), but now that you have maybe 4, it really isn't that valuable. Some distinction should be made, though, between admins and mods -- That's the only real recommendation I can give with absolute certainty here.

Originally Posted by Squiggy

Competent staffmembers could leave, incompetent could be approved working as staff. The only thing i'd do if i was admin, would be to give something like an ultimatum to every single inactive moderator, global, ect..
And if they don't fulfill it (get back to activity) they will be down graded but with a special remark that if they apply in future they have better chances to get re-upgraded.. if you know what i mean :D

I really think that activity isn't the only commandment of being a moderator. You have to represent the site in a dignified manner (Which I think only applies to about half the staff right now). I mean, some people in the staff might make good friends, but I would never consider them for staff positions myself. I'd give all of those people mini-mod in whatever sections they're good at, then recycle and be selective in other areas. Remember, five amazing moderators is much healthier and beneficial to a site than fifteen shitty ones.

Rising_Dusk, you do agree with separating the Admin from the Moderators, but you don't like the idea of colored names. Any other ideas? I honestly think colored names are the most clean and visually appealing way to do it.

Originally Posted by Gilles

Rising_Dusk, you do agree with separating the Admin from the Moderators, but you don't like the idea of colored names. Any other ideas? I honestly think colored names are the most clean and visually appealing way to do it.

The lack of colored names is both the least liked and most disliked out of all of the options in the poll.

Originally Posted by Gilles

Rising_Dusk, you do agree with separating the Admin from the Moderators, but you don't like the idea of colored names. Any other ideas? I honestly think colored names are the most clean and visually appealing way to do it.

Yes, actually, you can do it in a purely textual manner. Notice how right now, every user has an underlined name and that anything moderator and up has a bolded name. Take those both away, make normal users have normal text for their name, moderators have underlined names and a staff title, and administrators have bolded names and a staff title. Voillah, se bón.

Ha, that is exactly what I thought of before, but I though that names HAD to be underlined because they are links. Guess I was wrong then :P

Originally Posted by Rising_Dusk

Yes, actually, you can do it in a purely textual manner. Notice how right now, every user has an underlined name and that anything moderator and up has a bolded name. Take those both away, make normal users have normal text for their name, moderators have underlined names and a staff title, and administrators have bolded names and a staff title. Voillah, se bón.

I would still prefer colored names, but that is not a bad idea. I could easily live with that.

Actually, I think colored names should be applied to Hive Workshop staff. However, they should not have a variety of colors like green, blue, purple, etc. It should be set to one color. This is not to keep the site looking pretty, its to help point out who has authorization. Not sure if removing color from people's names of those who had donated money would be a good idea though, as it is one of the reasons they may've donated in the first place.

~Craka_J

As a normal user I find colors more appealing than bolded text. It's pretty plain, and the different colors stand out more. (Plus damn, everything else on the site is already green)

Craka, if we are to have different forum themes, it would be totally screwed up.

HT, you only like the loss of coloured names because you get one anyways!