Techtree Contest #5 - Innovation

[Pharaoh_]

You are right, didn't check every possible submission. Added skiiK and Dionesiist to the list.

 

[Ahimtar]

i updated my post and map here- NERUBIANS by Ahimtar
-a lot of tooltips improved
-fixed a few bugs with unit spells
-added a map with all the units spawned so you can test them immediately
-added a lot of screenshots
-the "game-crash-when-you-click-on-building" bug is still there though, i have no idea how to remove it

 

[ashbringer753]

Ahimtar, its probably a model error... Try changing its model to see it it still bugs.
And has anyone heard from the elemental races?(boomwolf and malcous)

 

[GhostThruster]

Yeah you should follow Deolrin's advice and check on the portrait.

 

[Dionesiist]

boomwolf is a lazy ass and dropped out.

 

[Deleted member 157129]

Yeah, so, this should cover all actual units, heroes and buildings in the techtree:

 

[ashbringer753]

shiik, i didnt know demons listened to heavy metal

 

[Ahimtar]

Ahimtar, its probably a model error... Try changing its model to see it it still bugs.

yes, it still bugs. and its not just one building, its in most of them, and also when i press the "build" button...

 

[Deleted member 157129]

yes, it still bugs. and its not just one building, its in most of them, and also when i press the "build" button...

Clone the map, save it on a new file, remove all custom data (disable triggers). Have the original map open in an extra window, and start copying parts one by one over to the new file - test in-game for every part. Eventually, you'll get to the part(s) that cause a crash, take note of them until you've imported everything else than the corrupt files, and then try to find out what's wrong with the files that cause a crash. Yes, it's damn tedious, but it will reveal the bug.

---

EDIT: I have not really been doing a whole lot today (shame one me), but I've put all the units into the object editor and imported the Alternate Melee races scripts making the race playable. You're able to build all the dummy buildings, train all the dummy units. None of the units have been given any attention beyond getting the basic Transfer Mana spell and either a name or a reference to the design document as well as pseudo-descriptions. Missiles, stats, everything will be changed in the coming days. I'll hopefully find models for the units and buildings that lack that as well. No abilities are done yet, either, so this is going to be a tight run.

Design Document (WIP) with credits and stuff..

 

[Ahimtar]

Clone the map, save it on a new file, remove all custom data (disable triggers). Have the original map open in an extra window, and start copying parts one by one over to the new file - test in-game for every part. Eventually, you'll get to the part(s) that cause a crash, take note of them until you've imported everything else than the corrupt files, and then try to find out what's wrong with the files that cause a crash. Yes, it's damn tedious, but it will reveal the bug.

well, i will try it... but is it 100% in triggers? no chance anything other?

 

[Wazzz]

well, i will try it... but is it 100% in triggers? no chance anything other?

only one way to find out

 

[Deleted member 157129]

well, i will try it... but is it 100% in triggers? no chance anything other?

What, no, did you even read what I said? This procedure is for testing ALL CUSTOM DATA. Custom units and imported resources are what most likely caused the error. If everything is imported properly to the object editor (and custom models, etc are applied), only then do you start enabling triggers, the most basic ones first so that you won't have any disabled dependencies. Considering this fault occurs when you click a unit, or issue an order, it is likely a corrupt model in your map. I have never heard of skins causing crashes, nor icons. If it's not a corrupt model, then it's a corrupt object - this could be anything from a tooltip to an ability. I'd be surprised if it is a trigger. Unless you have a trigger that runs when that specific unit is selected.

 

[Bannar]

@Ahimtar at first: disable all triggers and check if map bugs. If so, it's object data/imports. Some abilities/stuff can't be touched. Like ordering Sacrificial Pit to build unit and interrupt it immidiately => crash. There are ton of Object Data bugs to be honest; so better at first check if at least you can manipulate them.

 

[Ahimtar]

ok, i looked through it, and finally i found what causes the bug, but idk why...

it crashes everytime it is possible to build a custom unit or building-
for example my main building can not build any hatchlings or spiderlings, though if i replace them with peons, everything is ok...

 

[Bannar]

As I have already said: there are ton of OE bugs. Since I was pretty sure it's about wrong mix unit-building, I gave you Sarcificial Pit example.
Unfortunately, you can do nothing about it.

 

[Ahimtar]

okay... so i will just hope none of judges will click on some building or worker...

 

[Deleted member 157129]

Wait, let me get this straight; the unit that upon selection crashes the game can train "hatchlings" and "spiderlings", when you remove those two and make it train peons, it works? No crashes?

---

Edit: Here's the latest. All units now have names, voice sets, adjusted attack settings, costs and tooltips. Some lacking models and icons. Still a major lack of abilities and upgrades, but it's coming together. Most buildings still just use the reference to their design document entry, so it's a bit confusing in-game. But all dependencies should be working. I still need to add a race-specific item shop, but buildings and units are otherwise fleshed out. Hero abilities and aesthetics will be last priority. Didn't bother with a screenshot this time, as the only visual change is that I've gone back to using Frankster's town hall model; I didn't like how HappyTauren's model appeared small even in tier 3 (and I'm not talking about scaling), and that huge volcano on the bottom didn't seem to fit my race all that well. The race is fully playable, but you're at an obvious disadvantage due to lack of upgrades and abilities (not to mention the system for gaining mana is not implemented yet, so without cheats, you wouldn't be able to cast anything anyway). With unlimited gold, though, you have a great advantage because you can spawn as many spirits as you like (as opposed to them spawning on intervals, another not-yet-implemented system) and as such produce a more or less unlimited quantity of units simultaneously.

I had to put a picture here, else this post wouldn't catch your attention!

Design Document with credits, designs, and stuff..

---

Edit 2: Right, so I realized that WIP9 and 10 have a bug with the Build Structure command. WIP8 has a bug with selecting the Spirit. WIP7 has no crashes, but lacks a whole lot of changes. Anyway, I'm attaching three files for this very reason. I'll try to finish my object data before I try to find out the issue with build command.

 

[Kam]

I assume 11:59 means 11:59 PM?

 

[Ahimtar]

Wait, let me get this straight; the unit that upon selection crashes the game can train "hatchlings" and "spiderlings", when you remove those two and make it train peons, it works? No crashes?

yes, but its not only on those two, it happens in (i didnt test them all) most of my custom units. maybe there is a bug with evolving units (based on the berserking ability), but its kind of crucial to the race and im probably not going to rework it all...

 

[Deleted member 157129]

Behold, the Slayers
(Lamest race name, right? At least it follows the naming convention of the race, if you disregard the plural anyway.)
This post is the final entry, I will link back to this if I update further.

3rd Oct Log:
A full list of heroes, units, upgrades and buildings can be found in the Design Document and of course also in the map, apart from a few missing entries. Major redesign on unit production today because I came to realize Dionesiist had already implemented something very similar to what I had in mind. The new system utilizes combinations - there are four types of spirits (Red - ground, Purple - range, Blue - mage, Green - high tier), designed somewhat in a rush because I didn't want to rework the whole tier structure. By combining pairs of spirits, you create a unit. The full list of combinations can be found in the Design Document as well as in the tooltip (gold, lumber and supply cost is displayed in gold, dark green and brown colours, for each entry, respectively) for the Combine ability. Combining will not work if you do not have the necessary resources, a debug message will show up telling you what's missing. Still need to implement a check for the 2.17 Stahlhammer and 2.18 Chaos Wyrm preventing you from forming them if you do not have the necessary buildings (although it works out for now, as you still need tier 3 town hall). There's also the obvious lack of building time at the moment.

The mana system is half-implemented; attacking units will provide mana based on your class and damage dealt. However, health regeneration based on mana is not yet implemented. Another big thing that still misses is hero abilities. I have most of it drafted, as is apparent in the Design Document, but as I'm fairly bad at coding in vJass, I will probably not be able to finish all of that by the end of the day. I might just throw in some custom object editor abilities for the sake of giving the heroes purpose. Still lacking some models and icons, and some unit names could really do with a makeover, but as I said, aesthetics will be last priority.

Design Document with credits, descriptions, stuff. I recommend you at least have a look to have an understanding of what's missing and how the techtree is meant to behave.

4th Oct Log:
Race is fully playable, most abilities have been implemented, almost all upgrades implemented (the ones missing are not even in the design document). Somewhat out of balance due to lacking build time, and I have not been able to balance test it. I think it should offer some fun new ways of playing melee, though. Key pieces being the spirit combination system and the mana system. No unit is made obsolete, they all have unique roles as well as their tier role - Machine Head has the Mosh Pit ability which makes it an excellent decoy or mageshield throughout the game, Toxotes have Tracker Wards which gives the player good map control potential, Soulfly is the detector unit and is obviously used all game, Judas Priest function as summoner, debuffer, mage-support and healer (depending on how you use it) making it an essential part of the game, Gojira is an exceptional debuffer able to decide the outcome of any equally matched battle, Amaranthe is an harassing unit and really doesn't belong in a head to head battle, Stahlhammer is great for low-tier smashing and is efficient against enemy towers due to it's repair-preventing Incinerating Bash, Chaos Wyrm can do a great deal of tanking, and counters enemy air strategies well, Immortal is your essential big-battle spellcaster, similar to the high templar, this guy devastates packs of units with his Dragon Blaze, he will need some time in combat to build up mana if no enemy spellcaster can provide and lastly, the Mayhem Machine is the skeleton of any large scale attack on a well fortified enemy base.

I'd also like to mention that if I ham able to implement the health regeneration system I want, Judas Priest's healer role will come to light with Double Potency, seeing as the idea with mana-to-health regeneration is that more mana makes you regenerates faster. Immortal would also rightfully stand for his name with the Greater Siphon yielding a similar result to Double Potency.


5th & 6th Oct TO-DO:
- Hero Abilities Created 4 abilities for Khaos Maiden! (May Not Function Properly)
- Health Regeneration System FIXED!
- Unit Abilities FIXED!
- Unit Build Time DISREGARDED*!
- Prolific Shapery FIXED!
- Structure Upgrades FIXED!
- Balancing
- Aesthetics Added an icon!
* I've made spirits spawn slower, and Green Spirits (high tier) spawn even slower, to make up for the lack of building time - it is building time to wait for spirits anyway, although my experience is that there's an abundance of them for the most part.

LAST WORD:
A few issues that I just didn't manage to fix in time, I don't think the triggered abilities for the Khaos Maiden works properly. Balance is not tested properly, Computer players hardly count as opponents. The health and mana system isn't tweaked to perfection yet, so by ordering two Machine Head's to attack each other, they will eventually reach full mana and regenerate back, and although that was more or less the idea from the beginning, it's very easy to abuse for the Prolific Shapery. Mages also maintain their mana way too easily. While the tanks are actually not getting the regeneration benefit I wanted. Anyway, I won't drag this on, the post is already long enough. I'm half an hour late for the deadline, sorry, but I had to do a new preview and then I noticed a bugged icon, so I fixed. I wish I had more time to do aesthetics, but it's my own fault for starting late. I might use the techtree as a base for a few new resources, though.

IF THERE'S SOMETHING MISSING IN THE CREDIT (YOU FIND IT IN THE DESIGN DOCUMENT), PLEASE LET ME KNOW. I HAD ALL ALONG INTENDED TO CREDIT EVERYONE INVOLVED.

 

[67chrome]

All right, figure I'll post another wip of my race. I forgot how long doing things in the world editor takes, and how many tries it takes to get something to work XD

 

[General Frank]

Wow, spooky.

 

[sentrywiz]

I'd liked to participate in this, but seeing how many of you custom-model your units, I can guess no in-game goodies can win against models.

 

[Wazzz]

I'd liked to participate in this, but seeing how many of you custom-model your units, I can guess no in-game goodies can win against models.

...what

first of all, as far as i can tell, posts like this are utterly pointless. 'i was going to join but then i saw the competition and was like noooo way'.

but that's not the main point. the main point is you seem to be saying that people who make their own custom models or use imports are going to have a better chance than people who don't, purely based on...

......

......nothing at all

if you were going to not join the contest, i would have at least thought it would be because there's less than a day left to create a race and even if you managed to do that it would probably be THE most simple submition of the lot

honestly, some people

 

[ashbringer753]

wow chrome thats somenice stuff you got there, gl hf everyone. I'll probably update the map today with some graphical changes, a shop and building upgrades.

 

[Narogog]

Nerubian Wip.

it is stable, but not everything can be built yet.

View attachment (6)SwampOfSorrows Nerubian By Narogogv1.0.w3x

Features, a tunnel network system
units that spawn units when their projectiles hit stuff,
one hero almost finished hero.

 

[Bannar]

Here is my poor WiP.
Race Fallen

The union of Forgotten ones, underground beasts and Faceless warriors. More information will come tonight. I have to implement heroes still and fix tooltips.
Race features build-system you have never seen before.

Two pics

EDIT: Uploaded final version. Appologises for no descripsion, although if you enter WE you gonna have a lot of fun with this one.
And here are credits:

Credits

Credits:

- Ampharos_222 for Assailant Spire
- Ampharos_222 for Night Flyer
- Ampharos_222 for Mastermind
- Ampharos_222 for Facelss Veteran
- Ampharos_222 for Sabouteur
- Ampharos_222 for Mastermind missile model
- skrab for Stableyard
- Pyramidhe@d for Ametysk Tower
- RightField fir Altar model
- D.O.G. for Forgotten One Birth animation
- Calahan for Monoculus model
- Thrikodius for FRED model
- Amigurumi for Beholder
- tee.dubs for Blind Beast
- Dentothor for General Veraz model
- AnemicRoyalty for Apothecary model
- sPy for ArcaneBeam Rain effect
- sPy for ArcaneRocket projectile
- JetFangInferno for Haste effect
- JetFangInferno for VampiricAuraTarget
- shamanyouranus for Acid missile
- PeeKay for Punishment missle
- Mainy for Ghost aura model
- 67chrome for DragonStaffGreen icon

- Bribe For IsUnitMoving & Unit Indexer & Damage Engine

 

[Ahimtar]

the main point is you seem to be saying that people who make their own custom models or use imports are going to have a better chance than people who don't, purely based on......nothing at all

honestly, i think people with custom models have like 90% better chance to win at least in public poll, a lot of voters just looks at screenshot or just tests the map for a short time and then votes for the best looking one...




btw, why everyone who entered yet chose some evil demon-like theme? why no dwarves, pandarens, harpyes, ogres, trolls, furbolgs, gnolls, taurens, goblins, tuskarrs... not even murlocs?

 

[General Frank]

The reason might be that it might be too boring.

 

[Wazzz]

that's public polls, judge's votes are taken into account more so

although i can't help but wonder why we even have public polls, there is no way to prove that the voters so much as downloaded each map

also i don't see you choosing any of the races you mentioned, so why don't you tell us why you didn't choose them?

/was the first to pick demons

 

[Ahimtar]

i was just saying that it has some effect on the final result, although small

and, i thought about all those races, but i found out nerubians could be cool because i was making a spider hero recently and i kind of got into it

btw, i was just wandering, not blaming any of you

 

[ashbringer753]

Wazzz do not worry. Nobody is going to steal your demon idea, we know that you are the first to have picked demons, you already mentioned it three to four times in two pages.

Anyways check my update, added shop, done major graphical changes, balanced, added more abilities and building upgrades.

Find the latest version of my submission here: http://www.hiveworkshop.com/forums/2015902-post470.html

 

[67chrome]

I've always liked playing as warlocks, assassins, death knights and other evil characters. It just seems if someone is going to get a cheap skill with cool graphics, they are going to be evil. Also, when your goal is to kill your opponent outright, being good just doesn't make sense.

As for pooling, my favorite pool type was that used in the WC3c race building competitions; the Schulze Method. Everyone that voted had to rank the submissions they voted on, which prompted a lot of the voters to describe why they did so (if you didn't rank an entry it would be considered as gaining an average score). I'm not sure if something like that could be implemented on the fly for this contest though.
Example

The downside of course is not a lot of people vote, but the upside is everyone that does generally behaves like a a contest judge.

 

[Pharaoh_]

2 more days, I have received a pm of incomplete heroes and it's a shame after hours of work to score low points just for that.

67chrome, are you in?

 

[Kam]

You extended it again? Jesus I love you.

Edit: Below is final WIP minus the hero, which I'll be finishing today.

 

[ashbringer753]

Gaaaah seriously?! You could have said that before, so i dont have to rush my last minute updates and the tactical guide, check it out if you have the time and patience:http://www.hiveworkshop.com/forums/2015902-post470.html

I <3 Propaganda.

 

[Deleted member 157129]

Well, I was just going to add that I updated this: http://www.hiveworkshop.com/forums/2019528-post519.html

But seeing as it has been extended once more, I might have a chance to finish my heroes and the remaining abilities. Perhaps even finish the health regeneration system. Thank you.

 

[Pharaoh_]

By the way, this is the last extension, so fasten things up

 

[67chrome]

so here's my entry. Deadline kind of snuck up on me, so it's not as finished as i'd like

 

[Dionesiist]

I found one glaring bug, so to say, and that is the fact that the tier 2 and tier 3 town halls can't be selected without dragging the selection over them. It kind of makes doing anything that involves sending units inside impossible, since you can't click on the building. It's just a matter of recalculating extents in Magos.

 

[67chrome]

I found one glaring bug, so to say, and that is the fact that the tier 2 and tier 3 town halls can't be selected without dragging the selection over them. It kind of makes doing anything that involves sending units inside impossible, since you can't click on the building. It's just a matter of recalculating extents in Magos.

Thanks, still a total noob when it comes to using Magos XD.

I should probably update my race further (poison with the hydra doesn't work, HP and MP rewards for the drow units aren't applying proberly, etc.) but I have a lot of stuff on my to do list in RL so I'm not sure if I'll get a chance to fix it

anyways, here's a map with a tier 2 and 3 town hall that are selectable.

 

[Narogog]

another Wip
View attachment (6)SwampOfSorrows Nerubian By Narogogv1.5.w3x, i am very pleased with this version, and am going to add auto-pathing for the tunnels next, and maybe even a third hero.

 

[Ahimtar]

another Wip
View attachment 106899, i am very pleased with this version, and am going to add auto-pathing for the tunnels next, and maybe even a third hero.

i guess im just execrated.

 

[GhostThruster]

i guess im just execrated.

What the funk.

 

[Ahimtar]

What the funk.

i mean doomed

(i got no chance anyway, and now there is even another nerubian race in the game)

 

[Deleted member 157129]

I didn't even do half as much as I had planned to do today, but I did some work, updated the entry post with changes. Spent half my day in animation class, then when I got home I had to bitch around with BLPLab and GIMP to fix the icon I drew for the Fallen Angel skin - Khaos Maiden hero. Then I spent like.. hours, working out the health regeneration system and the Meteor Rain spell, tweaking and balancing those as well as the mana system. Luckily, the remaining unit abilities should be much easier to implement, especially seeing as I can pretty much base them off of one part or another from Meteor Rain. I also figured out how I'm going to do Unit Build time, so that should be easy. I'll try to get the spells done for Abrahadabra as well tomorrow, but I will do that last.

 

[67chrome]

Sounds cool, testing the entries to this contest should be a lot of fun.

Anyways, fixed and polished my entry a considerable amount. The gladiator bonuses apply correctly to everything now, and hydra's poison works the way it is described. Fixed a few tooltips here and there as well. My building models are still acting up and showing their build animations when working and screwing up the lighting but w/e.

I think i spent like, 80% of the time on my race on the hero spells alone. They should be fun to use, and their ultimates are very ultimaty.

-editing this post just to add a linky link to my overview. Check it out for more info on my race.

 

[ashbringer753]

So lets hope this will be the last extension and that everyone will finish his. Are we going to adopt the voting system that chrome proposed?

 

[Narogog]

So lets hope this will be the last extension and that everyone will finish his. Are we going to adopt the voting system that chrome proposed?

I vote yes.

 

[Wraithling]

I like the Schulze Method that chrome proposed too, but I don't fully understand it. Does anyone have a 100% knowledge of how its voting works?

A wiki link http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schulze_method